Veronica Hernandez, General Manager of the Modesto Nuts (Interview 4/100)

Veronica Hernandez, General Manager of the Modesto Nuts tells a great story of her journey starting as an unpaid intern for two different teams and the working her way up to her current position as woman GM in minor league baseball. She’s a wealth of advice from finding ways to make sacrifices to get to where you want to go, to the importance of curating a network around you, and not being discouraged by imperfection.

There are many similarities to Greg Moore’s nuggets of wisdom: treating people with compassion and humanity, recognizing that you don’t need to have all the answers and the humility of realizing that, and giving back to the community in all different kinds of ways. 

Her comment, “I just learned this last week,” is an example of her life-long learner mentality that also showed through when I asked her about finding stability with so many moving pieces and she said, “I don’t.” If our work isn’t perfect, it just gives us something to improve. It’s a great reminder that we don’t need to be perfect, we just need to find where we can improve.

It’s her laid back, but confident demeanor and leadership style that really struck me as admirable. Especially when I brought up how the women in my network were wanting to know about her experiences navigating the stereotypical “good ‘ol boys club” of mens baseball as a woman in the General Manager position. She talked about not taking it personally and surrounding yourself with people that can loop you in as needed so you can know what you’re talking about (again, it’s all about who you are surrounding yourself with and continue learning).

I think we can all learn from that mentality.

I’ll leave you with her wise words about not just intervening for a job, but interviewing the company to see if it’s a good fit, “What do you want out of the company that you’re working for?”

Shout outs to: Jesse Cole from the The Savannah Bananas and California Rural Legal Assistance Foundation

Early and bonus shows as well as curated discussions and merch are available on Patreon.

Instagram | BioSite (with links to listen & more) | Blog & Transcripts 

Transcript

Hey folks, thanks so much for coming to the Capitalism for Good Podcast. It's here where we'll focus on exploring how we both make and spend our dollars to benefit the greater good. Folks, today we have Veronica Hernandez, the general manager for the Modesto Nuts.

It's a minor league baseball team located in Modesto, California. And she talks about sacrifice in her journey from starting as an unpaid intern and then working her way up to being the general manager of the club like she is now. And she's also got some really great advice for embracing the chaos in how when things don't go perfectly, that allows us the ability to strive and work toward something better and to learn some lessons and always be improving.

I've really enjoyed talking to her and excited for you guys to enjoy that conversation. Thank you so much for joining me, Veronica. Will you start by introducing yourself and talk a little bit about your journey to your current position as general manager of the Modesto Nuts, a minor league baseball team in Modesto, California?

Yeah, so I have been working in minor league baseball for, I think, close to 12 years. I actually am originally from Connecticut, so I have moved across the country with different teams. I think that is especially to note because if you do want to grow, and I feel like that's a two-factor side, if you're ready to grow, which is a conversation to have between yourself, literally, and also like mentors.

But if you are ready to grow, then like this career can take you as far and as fast as you want it to, but you need to be flexible with location. So that's just the tricky part about working in the sports industry, is location is everything, and I mean that in the sense of fandom, I mean that in the sense of back-end like sales and partnerships and relationships, personal and professional. So yeah, it's a whirlwind for sure.

But from there, my journey, like I mentioned, started in Connecticut. I think it's especially to note that I started off as an intern, and an intern back then was $0 an hour. So unpaid internship, and that's tough because nowadays, I mean, I've been in California for the last few years, so it's definitely not existent in California.

But I think that's where you show your real colors, right? What are you going to do for $0 an hour? Because that's going to dictate what you're going to be doing for the salary that you are interested in gaining.

Or at least I had to prove myself, right? I worked two different teams at that time at $0 an hour. So I was really not compensated for just life needs, gas, food, roof over your head, all of that stuff.

And everyone has their own story and their own journey. But in mine, I had to make that work. I was working a few other jobs with these internships to make sure my life can continue financially.

But also I was getting the experience I needed to move forward in my career. So I think most careers need this, but there is sacrifice needed. And that's something that people maybe glimpsely talk about, but not in-depth, like as I mentioned, it was a whole season of $0 an hour at well over 40 hours a week.

And yeah, like how do you make that work for yourself and for the team and proving yourself and all of that good stuff? So from there, luckily, my life and the way that I finagled my schedule was able to do all of those things, get my experience and get my name through the door. That's the hardest thing about the sports industry.

And I might even say just to get a decent job is like, how do you compete with the 20 other people that apply to the role or the 200 or the 2000? And the reality of it is networking. If your name doesn't jump off out of a list, you're being really hopeful that your resume does.

And I've had some harsh realities in the start of my journey where they're like, hey, you have a great resume, it's just not enough. It's hard to compete with really high other potential candidates. And it sucks because I was that person that needed to have a network to help gain into that second step.

And I didn't. And it didn't work. I mean, fresh out of college or before I even graduated, I started applying jobs, hundreds.

Got one interview. One interview that didn't go a second round. And one of my questions in that interview, I asked good stuff? So from there, luckily, my life and the way that I finagled my schedule was able to do all of those things, get my experience and get my name through the door. That's the hardest thing about the sports industry.

And I might even say just to get a decent job is like, how do you compete with the 20 other people that apply to the role or the 200 or the 2000? And the reality of it is networking. If your name doesn't jump off out of a list, you're being really hopeful that your resume does.

And I've had some harsh realities in the start of my journey where they're like, hey, you have a great resume, it's just not enough. It's hard to compete with really high other potential candidates. And it sucks because I was that person that needed to have a network to help gain into that second step.

And I didn't. And it didn't work. I mean, fresh out of college or before I even graduated, I started applying jobs, hundreds.

Got one interview. One interview that didn't go a second round. And one of my questions in that interview, I asked they capable for the position? On paper, they say they might.

Verbally, they say they might. But I've also had the experience where we sit them down in person and they are not. So when I get that referral from whomever it is, a community partner, a friend, someone in my network, I trust that resource because they know who I'm looking for.

They've heard my frustrations with a particular position. And then they're like, hey, I have a perfect candidate for you. So yeah, I'm going to prioritize and interview that candidate.

I'm going to challenge them during the interview. And then another peaceful advice is, yeah, you're being interviewed, but you should also interview your company. So challenge them with the hard questions.

And it's tough as an entry-level staff to know what the right questions are. But start with asking, what do you want out of the company that you're working with? Right?

Is work-life balance important to you? Is the work culture important to you? Tear apart those questions.

Ask the uncomfortable ones. That's so important that a lot of entry-level interviews that I have don't. Like, I'd be lucky if I can pull a question out of them sometimes.

So yeah, so my journey started straight up unsuccessfully, I would say. A door slammed in my face, I graduated, I took on a few different jobs, I made it a mission to pay off my student loans because I knew the sport industry wasn't gracious with entry-level pay. And then I got to a point that I paid off my student loans and I felt like, hey, I can now come back to the table and see how I can get into the sport industry.

And that was the hardest humbling I've ever had to do. I went from getting paid a decent wage straight out of college to getting paid zero dollars an hour to pursue my career. And again, I talk about sacrifices, that was a sacrifice that I had to do.

But then from there, or at least for me, my work spoke for itself. So now all of a sudden, these executives are like, wow, this candidate is awesome and they're doing a lot of work and they're running around and they're really improving our operation and so on and so forth. And then all of a sudden, it's like a free for all being like, okay, I want them, how do I get them?

And really the, I'll say it again, networking, right? I have to go speak with them. I have to get to know them.

I have to challenge them. They might like me, they might not. And I guess the other helpful piece of advice is don't get heartbroken when you're not chosen, right?

Like it's a harsh reality that things happen for a reason. And like if you are interviewing your employer and you hear something that you don't like but you really wanted that job and you really want it for that organization, then that's a decision you have to make. Do you really want to work for the job and have this one item that you really don't like about them?

Or do you just move on and find a new goal? So from there, again, like networking has helped me out a lot. So I started at zero dollars an hour, was referred to go to the winter meetings at the time, was in person, was blessed with several job opportunities.

And I kept in touch with those that offered me a job, right? I turned them down, but every year I, or maybe at that point it was like six to eight months, I would check in being like, hey, how's it going? I saw you did this promotion.

It was really cool. Tell me more. Those like not needy conversations, right?

I don't need a job. I'm asking for advice or guidance. Like that helps build rapport.

And then when I need a job, I'm like, hey, what's up? What positions do you have open? And I'm looking, I want something more challenging.

And where can I go from here? And that has helped, honestly, probably every state after I got that first real paid position. Those conversations had helped me gain my next role.

And I know this sounds very braggy, but it's made the interview process a lot easier for me. The application process is so much easier for me. And people, what a lot of employees don't realize is people realize the little details that you are or are not doing.

And if that is a future employer for you, it might be a minute to reevaluate how you conduct yourself in a role or at an organization.

Yeah. Can I ask why? And I ask this question because this is so true of me.

I grew up in a sports family. We all played sports growing up throughout my professional career. I'm constantly looking at things through the lens of sports, like comparing coaches to general managers and CEOs, and team captains to team leads, and just building a teamwork mentality and philosophy within groups, and healthy competition with your competitors, and all those kinds of things.

This is a little bit of a two-part question. One, why sports for you? And two, where, if at all, do you see that overlap in your professional life?

To get clarification on the second question, what overlap are you referencing? Like in a sense, coaches to other areas?

Or just the philosophy of sports and in professional workplace environment.

So why sports for me? I was really blessed in high school. I took a marketing course.

And at that time, I realized I loved sport marketing. I had to do like a case study on Nike. And I just loved the ideology of one image can say a thousand things.

And Nike has done that so well in the sense of their marketing. And I just ran with it. Like I loved the marketing piece.

And I loved what we were marketing, right? And it's, yeah, you're selling tickets to a game, but you're also selling like fandom and motivation and habits. And again, Nike does a stellar job on that piece of communication.

So that's the why, the where. I mean, when you work a lot in event logistics, which I would say I have done very much so in my career, you see everything through an operations lens. It doesn't matter if I'm at a conference.

It doesn't matter if I'm at a staff meeting. That notion of what was my experience before I got there? What was my experience getting there?

What was my experience while I was there? Was the material attainable, realistic, interesting? All of that stuff, I see that through the operational lens.

And when you mention like, you know, why are organizational structures formed like sports teams? I think the beautiful, and I just learned this like last week, no matter what you're doing, you're moving as one, right? Even as like a family, right?

You're moving as one. As a non-profit organization, for-profit organization, financial industry, electrical industry, whatever it is, you're moving as one. And the beautiful relation that I have to that is, I saw these images of like all of these birds flocking together.

And I'm not talking about the V shape, I'm just talking about thousands of birds just moving together in this weird format. And someone made it a point being like, why do you think those birds never crash? Like, there's thousands of them moving like in a circle, right?

So they are intended to crash, but yet they don't. And it just goes to show like that is where you want your team culture to be. How many times in family or professionally do you clash?

For whatever reason, maybe structurally to make sure logistics are run through correctly, or maybe frustratingly, you guys are crashing. And it's very interesting, that kind of bird philosophy of how do they move, one group's move right while the other group is moving left, and yet none of them are crashing near each other. And it's that formulation of one bird is starting to turn and then all of a sudden, it's a domino effect of turn, turn, turn, turn, turn, turn, turn and we're turning all around.

And that's, yeah, like I would love to have a team move like birds. I know that sounds ridiculous, but yeah, like I think that would be any GM or CEO or executive director, that would be their goal is to move as one. Yeah.

It's so interesting. Also, I'm going to go back to your comment about Nike, because I've been thinking about Nike so much because I just started reading, I'm probably like a third of the way through Shoe Dog by Phil Knight talking about. So right now, we're still in the beginning.

He goes to Japan and he's got this pitch and he sends the $500 or whatever it was or $50 and nothing happens. And I share your kind of interest in how they got started and how they have done such a good job of sticking to that brand so well. And that's one of the things that I think about.

And as I've been talking to different business leaders through this project, one of the through lines, well, one, you mentioned this, is details are key. And then the people that you surround yourself by and your reputation that follows through those people is so, so, so important. And so in thinking about that for you, how do you, I'm gonna zoom out a little bit and say like, so your team mentality that you're managing this baseball team, and everything that comes along with it, the operations, the facilities, the all the pieces that come together, how do you keep that working like the birds, like the team, like that?

How do you, how do you find like the stability in all of that? That's so many moving pieces

I think the simple answer is I don't.

I mean, that's a good realistic answer.

There's, there's so many operators, great operators out there that I would probably say that they don't, right? And I think there's two levels to it. They hold themselves to a higher standard, right?

Like we want to operate every event perfectly. However, we also want to improve every event. So how are you supposed to operate perfectly when you're also trying to improve at the same time?

And I think another simple answer is the direct reports, right? They have to be strong. Like I don't have time to worry about trusting someone to do their job.

Like I need you to do your job and I don't need to rethink that through and worry, did you do this? Did you do that? Is this checkbox done?

Is that not? And I realized, especially in this position, and it wasn't immediate, it wasn't in the first two years, I finally was able to let go a little bit, being like, he's got it. I don't need to question.

I don't need to remind him. What I did realize and I did realize this within the last like six months to a year, I need all of my employees to think faster than I do. And that, how do you ask an entry level staff to think faster than the GM who's been doing this for over a decade?

Like it's hard, but it's learning from your mistakes and not doing them twice. Right? That's huge.

Right? I think that there's a lot of grace given to people who make that error once, but I can speak personally once you make that error twice. I'm like, all right, you spoke about this three times.

I'm like, okay, we've definitely spoken about this, what's going on? And then I start getting frustrated. So it's the two layers of we don't operate perfectly as we wanted to.

And also having high operators, people that you can trust. And I'll be honest, those two things are not always in the same person. You really need to find your people.

And I did not learn that well in my first two years. And interestingly enough, I thought about this like yesterday. I was just like, no wonder, going back to the coaching philosophy, when there's a new coach or GM in town, they clean house.

Like, it kind of all clicked to me being like, yeah, it makes sense, because you need to surround yourself with people you can trust. Not worth the next two years with someone that you can't trust. And now you're thinking about that constantly.

Like that's just not efficient.

Yeah. I, so I'm going to take this back to you personally a little bit, if you're okay with that. I asked my kind of network of people around me what they most wanted to hear from you, specifically as as a female GM of a male team.

I'm sure you get this question a lot, but people want to know, and I want to know, like, well, I'm going to quote my friend Ashley here. She said, do you have experience with the good old boys club type of mentality? And if so, what has that been like?

And what is your advice for navigating that successfully?

Okay, by experience with the good old boys club? Yes, that's an opinion. However, it's not a yes that like, yay, I've made it.

I mean, I have made it work, but it hasn't come without its challenges.

Right.

Having conversations behind my back, I mean, that still happens to this day. So what I've had to learn, and this was a hard lesson to learn and swallow, is to not take it personally, take the high road and move on. I've changed my mentality a lot.

I mean, I would say over the past decade of not thinking the worst of people. So I try to not think of the worst of people and being like, hey, maybe they didn't tell me because they forgot, or because I wasn't there that day, or not because they were acting selfishly and privately and against me. And what's nice about that is that that helps me confront the situation, not negatively, not aggressively, but being like, yeah, I heard about this, what's up?

What's up with that? What's anything you need to share kind of thing? And then that's when you kind of can see the true colors of what, you know, people are trying to hide or not hide or a mistake or not a mistake on that end.

But yeah, it's weird. I mean, even more to a point, I don't have a softball background. I don't have a baseball background.

So like understanding the sport. I mean, people ask me all the time being like, hey, you should join our softball team because you're the GM of a team. And I'm like, cool.

I'll probably be the worst player.

Yeah.

So happy to play. I love being outside. I love being active, but don't expect great things from me.

And that also affected too, because sometimes people, I mean, in any business, people talk a million miles an hour and you're trying to keep up and when you don't know the material, it's hard to keep up. So I had that learning curve ahead of me too, which obviously being in this industry for so long, I went from knowing zero about baseball to now, like if I talk about baseball, people actually think I know what I'm talking about, but like it's just because I surround myself with people that can loop me in. And what I mean by that is like, for example, Curtis Washington, he's hitting over 400 batting average. Curtis Washington is a great guy. Like I love him as a human. I did not pick up those stats on my own.

I didn't go deep into our statistical website and learn those things. I was having a happy conversation with a big baseball fan and they shared it with me. And now I locked it into my brain because when I'm now speaking about Curtis Washington, I can say he's crushing it.

And I'm learning and absorbing. And I think that's really hard for many reasons, but doing that as I go and that really supports me as an employee to attain the respect, I guess you can say, of like, okay, well, she knows what she's talking about. And it's just like, yeah, I know what I'm talking about because I learned it about two hours ago.

But if you asked me two hours ago, I would have been like, yeah, he's a great guy. Like, I know that, like, I know him as a person. He is a great human.

So it's, I don't know, I guess it's like a trade secret that I don't, I don't know everything, but I listen, I try to take notes even though sometimes material has nothing to do with me. Like, I do that a lot in our community, and it's a little bit of interest, I would say. But like, sometimes people are like, how do we fix hunger?

And I'm like, all right, as a baseball team. And they're like, that's not apples to apples, right? I'm not donating millions, thousands of dollars.

And I listen, though, and I don't know, I have a pathway in my head that I'm like, okay, we can't donate that much food, but we can be a catalyst for it. We can host this event at our ballpark. We can do those things.

So it's always those kind of like brain connections of just like, I don't know what you're talking about. Okay, I'm picking up what you're saying. This has nothing to do with me.

But then somehow, I always get it back to how can we help, how can we support, how can we be a part of this mission? And it's kind of the circle of karma is I was able to help them out. In turn, they were able to help me out.

And it was a big relationship business accomplishment between both parties to be able to execute a good effort for the community.

Yeah. And thinking about that, so much about this Capitalism for Good project is focused on community, both the internal community, but also the external community. And you just touched on that, that so much of your job in the club is about the external community and those partners, whether they're non-profit partners or your for-profit partners, your sponsors, all of these types of things.

Can you talk a little bit about how you go about finding and maintaining and fostering those relationships?

Yeah. Okay. So there's different nuances to it.

So the one thing that I felt, especially my entry-level sales staff, I was just like, think of yourself as a marketing consultant for every one of your clients. I do not want you to be a used card salesman. I want the client to be extremely happy with what they agreed to sign up for and what they get from it, like ROI or whatever it is.

That's the first thing that I always talk to new clients with. I always sit down, I'm like, hey, I just want to talk about partnership. I'm not talking about advertising.

I'm not talking about me donating. I just want to know a little bit about you, a little bit about what your current marketing tactics are, a bit more about your mission, and a bit more about your goals. Again, very consultant-esque focused first.

This is that learning part that I was talking about before, is now I'm receiving all of this wealth of knowledge of this particular client, what their goals are, and I'm thinking, how can I help you? What in my resources can I do to help you? And sometimes, it's an outfield billboard because they're focusing on branding.

But other times like I'm also learning that they don't really know what they want. And I'm like, cool, you think you want an outfield billboard, but you're a small business. You don't have that much funds to be allocating on just one thing.

And two, you should probably also be focusing on getting people to your store or buying from you online because you getting your branding out, unless you had that Boku dollars to spend on branding, it's not the best first step because you're going to get frustrated because you're going to be like, I didn't get any money off of that wall sign. Well, of course, you didn't get any money off of that wall sign. That's not how the psychology of branding works.

And that's the interesting part of being. I mean, it helps me having a marketing background, that's for sure. But I think it also is a point to being like, how much can you learn on the job to better help your projects on the job?

So there's a lot of those conversations. And sometimes I tell clients' advice where I'm like, do not do that. Do not spend this much money with us.

Like yeah, I would love to, that'll help us out. But you might get frustrated at the end, and I want to make sure you're happy. And sometimes the clients are like, you know what?

No, I still want that outfield wall. And I'm like, okay, I gave you my advice, I gave you my best recommendation, but you still want that outfield wall sign. I'm glad I would happily put you out there, happily to send you over the contract, happily to collect the money for sure.

But just managing those expectations throughout the year. So it's like every time you bump into them, you check in on them. How's it going?

How are you doing? And then you'll eventually get into, is that outfield wall working or not? Now they understand my perspective of branding versus ROI.

And it doesn't leave them frustrated, it leaves them educated. And that's an effort that I don't think is enough exclaimed of like, I would rather my clients spend less money and be happy, than spend all of these dollars and be frustrated, and then in turn not work with us in the future. So it's, I don't know, I guess it's care.

You have to not be selfish in the sense of me and the Modesto Nuts or me personally. It's about like, what can I do better for this client? And I'll be honest, sometimes I come in with non-profits because I'm like, hey, it's a really good idea that you can do fundraising and this is going to help us generate ticket sales and it's going to be great.

Sometimes they don't have the bandwidth for it and that's okay. And guess what? We have a donation ticket program where I can still get their volunteers out here for a fun night and I'm not getting much out of it.

I'm donating tickets. And if that's where it leads to, then that's where it leads to and it's fine. And I was still able to help out a non-profit, maybe not help me out, but I was able to help them out so they could do a team builder with their volunteers.

Yeah. Okay, my next question, Dealer's Choice for how you want to answer this. But it's, what do you see or what are you working toward in the future?

And I say Dealer's Choice because it can be you personally and your career goals and aspirations, or it can be with the organization and where you want to position that.

So awkward time for this question. Because unfortunately for us, this is our last year in Modesto, the team is moving down south. And we were recently acquired by DBH, so Diamond Baseball Holdings.

That's a huge ownership group that has a bunch of teams across the country. So there is an opportunity for me to continue my career and growth. However, going to your question about personal life, my personal life does not let me leave this area for probably another five years.

So I had to really learn, what do I want next? I've only saw a career in sports, so I had no idea what industry, like my backgrounds in marketing and event planning. But do I want to still do that?

Do I just want to start fresh book entirely? So it's a lot of self-learning and this is the advice that I was giving earlier with entry-level staff is, hey, I know what I hate about this job, I know what I love about this job, and now I'm going to go find what I love and ask the pressing questions of what I know I don't like and find a company that can check off both boxes, which is incredibly difficult. But there are companies that exist like that, but you have to press on those hard questions.

Yeah. I cannot relate to that more. When I left my last full-time job before I started on my own, that's really where I found myself is I was like, I can tell you everything that I don't like and that I don't want to do, and all of these, but I can't really tell you specifically, and it took me probably like, I mean, this journey.

It's been a year ago as plus four days since that happened, and just recently within the past few months have I been like, all right, I have a really good idea of where I want to go, where I want to go with my company, where I want to go with potential next organizations, all of those kinds of things, but I am lucky, it was very blessed to be able to have been able to take a step back and be like, all right, let me focus on building something for myself and take a breath and think about it. I hear you working those jobs where you're working well over 40 hours, and you're just like, I can't think about anything else right now. I just tunnel vision so much right now.

Yeah, exactly.

My last question that I want to end on with you is, what's another business or leader or person that you see out there doing things the right way? Who else do you think deserves a shout out? It could be an old boss, an old mentor, a coworker, someone that you see in the community, or a company that you are a customer of.

It could be absolutely anything or anyone.

In the baseball terms, and I know a lot of people in baseball are going to probably hate that I'm going to say this out loud, but it's the Savannah Bananas, Jesse Cole. He's pushing the envelope, and what I love to hear in his interviews is that he's not an expert. He's just trying new things literally every day, and over a dozen new things every day is terrifying, but also exhilarating.

The success that he's garnished over the last few years show that. It shows, when you put the fans first, what can you reap from, and it's just, I don't even, I, without knowing the number, I know some high-level numbers, but without going into the weeds, I couldn't imagine what it is to have millions of people on a waiting list. What?

Good for you, man. Everyone in the event industry wants to figure that out, and he did. Being in minor league baseball, I've put up a lot of excuses of, it's really hard to replicate that.

But if you challenge yourself hard enough, there's a way to do it in the scope of major league baseball. It's just no one has really thought it through and replicated it, so everyone can be successful. That's the point about life.

Not everyone, unfortunately, will be successful. Then on top of that, it's just challenging the norm, challenging the traditions. Why are we doing this?

I don't know. That's not an answer anymore. Is there no reason?

Because then let's do things differently, and it's going to be ugly and uncomfortable at first, but be comfortable with the uncomfortable. That would be my first person I thought of in industry-wide things. But locally, there's this non-profit called CRLA, and I've got to know their CEO pretty well over the last couple weeks, month.

The more and more I learn about the strategic plan and how much they spend time on hearing from everyone, so easy. It's like mind-boggling, but not enough companies do that. One of their pillars is very focused on work culture, lifestyle, and all of that stuff, and for the longevity of it, once it rolls out, it's to keep consistency in the office, and that is something that every business is trying to master.

So dedicating time to do that. Some of these things aren't rocket science. It's just have a minute to breathe, and then figure out how to have a minute to execute, because that's the hardest part, is finding the bandwidth to get the things, the extra things done that you want to do.

Yeah. Oh, that's so great. Thank you so much for taking the time to do this.

I wish you all the best. It was so great to talk to you.

Thank you. Yeah. Let me know if you need anything else.

Very, very happy to help, and I wish you the best of luck with this whole interview process. It sounds very interesting.